Starkey Sound Bites: Hearing Aids, Tinnitus, and Hearing Healthcare
Being a successful hearing care professional requires balancing a passion for helping people hear with the day-to-day needs of running a small business.In every episode of Starkey Sound Bites, Dr. Dave Fabry — Starkey’s Chief Health Officer and an audiologist with 40-years of experience in the hearing industry — talks to industry insiders, business experts and hearing aid wearers to dig into the latest trends, technology and insights hearing care professionals need to keep their clinics thriving and patients hearing their best. If better hearing is your passion and profession, you won’t want to miss Starkey Sound Bites.
Starkey Sound Bites: Hearing Aids, Tinnitus, and Hearing Healthcare
Prioritizing Hearing Protection for Police Officers
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Loud noises are part of the job for first responders, but protecting their hearing is tricky because they must always maintain situational awareness. In this episode, a 40-year law enforcement veteran talks about the importance of hearing protection, and how SoundGear has been a game changer for the Arizona State University police department.
To learn more about SoundGear, visit www.SoundGear.com.
Welcome to Starkey Soundbites. I'm your host, Dave Favory, Starkey's Chief Hearing Health Officer. Now, Protect Your Hearing Month is every October. And in this episode, we're going to focus a little bit on getting a jump start on that very important topic, specifically for professionals working in law enforcement. Now, before we dive in, a quick note. For those of you who've listened to this podcast in the past, we greatly appreciate your patronage. And if you have ideas for content that we should cover in the future, please send us an email at soundbites at starkey.com and we'll address your suggestions and bring in other experts like we have here today to address those topics in the future. But I do want to I'm deeply privileged to have Stu Beddocks with us today and Michael Scholl. Now, Stu, you have a 40-year career in law enforcement. And most importantly, and lately you were chief of the Arizona State University Police Force, correct?
SPEAKER_00Correct. And thank you for having me here. I'm quite honored to be here.
SPEAKER_02Well, it's it's a pleasure. And I know we're going to do a deep dive a little bit on your personal experience and then as well talk a little bit about how it is that we can focus on preserving the hearing of those who've protect who are protecting the public. And Michael Scholl, you uh Stu's had a 40-year career. I say you haven't worked really at anything because you love what you're doing, but you do really and are distinguished by two titles at Starkey. Not only are you the chief business development officer, but you're also the executive vice president of corporate relations. So, Michael, thanks for coming back to Starkey.
SPEAKER_01It's great to be back here, and this is such an important topic. It really is. You know, we all spend so much time talking about uh, you know, hearing prevention, conservation. It's great to be here talking about sound gear. It's a really important topic, especially during this important month.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think many people have said, you know, it's strange for a hearing aid company to be focused on trying to protect hearing uh when really we'd be looking at trying to generate more business. But uh as I've said, uh not not kiddingly at all, there's plenty of business for us to go around. There's the stigma that is associated with hearing loss and the use of hearing aids. And Sound Gear is our effort to really address rather than fixing things after they're broken, let's try to address things up front and protect those people who are in noise.
SPEAKER_01Well, and as you know, Dr. Fabery, we're always talking about the comorbidities related to hearing loss, right? So, exactly to your point, let's protect individuals hearing and let's prevent those on the front end, uh, you know, so individuals have the ability to live a long, uh, you know, fruitful life.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And we know that while hearing loss can strike at any age, uh, the most likely factors after birth and genetic uh conditions that can cause hearing loss at a young age, birthdays and noise exposure uh will contribute to hearing loss, and they're inextricably intertwined. So, Stu, let's uh talk a little bit about your personal experience. Uh we know that you have a um son-in-law that is well familiar to us, correct, uh, Blaise Delfino. Can you give us any dirt on him that we can use? But uh we know that that hearing has been something that you have awareness for more recently. Yes. And then um while um he and his wife are working to uh deliver a grandbaby to you, which we're excited about.
SPEAKER_00Yes, we're very excited about that.
SPEAKER_02And we also know that that hearing has been an issue that has been on your mind, not only from your 40 years in in law enforcement, but also personally. Can you talk a little bit about that?
SPEAKER_00Well, knowing Blaze, and and it's funny because uh my career in law enforcement goes back to 1984. Uh graduated from the police academy, and boy, it seemed so long ago. But over those years, just you know, being involved with uh the fourpence uh I worked with over that that span, uh, either as a chief or assistant chief. And and the whole time, you know, never really focusing on hearing protection because I never knew what was out there until my son-in-law said, Hey, we'd like to uh come in and uh show you some of the products that Starkey offers. And so we were open to that. But I mean, for for years, it was just wearing the earmuffs or putting into foamies, and and I was under the impression that's that's all that was out there, uh, as well as my officers. We would go to the range and uh, you know, here you go, set of earmuffs, or they give us the foamies. Um, but that was the only place we were protecting our hearing. Right. And and there's a lot of different things that happen uh in a police officer's life. So, you know, usually the range is the part that is what everybody focuses on because of the gunfire. It's very loud and it can be very damaging to your ears. Uh, there's been a number of times where I'd be standing on the range and I didn't have my ear protection on, and somebody would fire a gun, and boy, does it wake you up right away. Um, but there are other things that you know concern me with uh, for example, you know, going into a building with an active fire alarm blazing. They are very I've been sure if somebody you know accidentally burns their popcorn or something and sets off the the uh fire alarm in in this building, it's loud.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00But when everybody else is getting out, the police officers are coming in and they don't have the ability on the road to have their earmuffs or their foamies, you know, in their duty bag. Um so those are some of the things that we considered and thought about when I was at ASU and we found out about the sound gear product.
SPEAKER_02And one thing I was gonna say is police officers, as you mentioned, certainly the the range is an area where you're shooting a lot of rounds, you've got people shooting in close proximity, much more so than the average hunter. And so by virtue of that alone, they're at elevated risk for noise noise inducing.
SPEAKER_00So they're required twice a year to qualify, and that's you know, a few hunter rounds each time. But one of the things that we focused on at ASU is so you we have the officers that do it twice a year, but then you have your your firearms trainers that do it every day. Um so I had a 12-man firearms training unit at ASU, and uh we decided to uh to uh protect their hearing, those are the people that we started with. Yeah, we went after those 12 officers and we're like, you know, we want to get a product for you. And then coincidentally, we had eight new recruits who were going into the police academy. And, you know, I said said to my command staff at the time, I'm like, you know, why don't we start protecting their hearing right from the get-go? So these are eight brand new officers that are going to the police academy, early 20s. You know, let's start protecting their hearing now instead of trying to do something five, 10, 15 years later. Well, maybe it could be too late.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, well, you talked about that you entered the police force in 1984. Yes. And at that time, although OSHA laws were in existence, non-compliance was probably a greater issue with uh people knowing that they had foamies. But you know, what's the challenge for that when someone is not at the not at the target range but out on active duty? Do many officers going back to your experience as a young police officer and then continuing to then where you're supervising large forces, what's the problem with foamies? Are are people wearing them?
SPEAKER_00No, no. What they're doing is if they come into an environment, um, they're just they just go in and risk it. Uh they're not wearing any hearing protection. And they also, you know, I think um officers don't like to put in hearing protection because they want to be aware of their surroundings. Uh they want to be able to hear what's behind them, what's you know, what's happening, using their senses while doing their job.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02Well, Michael, you use a phrase and expression that you've learned from interacting um with uh veterans and active duty military. Do you mind sharing that with you?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, you know, having you know many conversations with uh both VA and military audiologist. And I ask, you know, when you see somebody, you ask them, are they wearing hearing protection? Have they been wearing hearing protection? And uh the phrase that I've heard more than once from military audiologist is no, because they would the the the individual would rather be deaf than dead, right? And it's and it's to Chief Beddock's point is with foamies or other solid protection, you don't have the situational awareness, right? And if you are a first responder, if you are in the military, you not only need the protection, but you better believe you need to know what's happening around you, right? And with your colleagues and the other, you know, uh officers who are supporting you and that you are supporting. So um just using a solid plug that suppresses and doesn't amplify, as the chief said, folks don't have any interest in that.
SPEAKER_00Let me share a quick story with you. So um when I got to ASU, we had already had an officer who was hired prior to me getting there. Um, and I think he was a 12-year veteran, and he came in one day with a letter from his doctor, and the doctor more or less said that his hearing was uh damaged so bad that he no longer could could perform the duties of a police officer. And it was because of his safety. The doctor more or less said his hearing's so bad he can't hear people coming up behind him. And we had found out, because I questioned him like, well, how did we even hire this guy? Because every police officer who gets hired, no matter what agency I've worked for, they have to have a baseline hearing test done to, and and the doctor signs off on it, and he says that they have the ability to perform the duties of a police officer. This one individual, his hearing was bad because he was in the military. He was uh, you know, at the range, and I don't know what he his duty or his assignment was when he was in the military. But we uh, for whatever reason, uh the chief at the time signed off on it and we hired this guy, and then he became one of our range instructors, again, using foamies and earmuffs, and a lot of times those are the guys that they don't like to wear them and stuff like that. And lo and behold, 12 years into his career, his career was over. Um, and so it was a shame.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I hate to I hate to hear that because I think you raise another really important point is that individuals prior to joining the force may have had military experience where they didn't wear protection, and they also might enjoy other noisy hobbies, whether it's woodworking or whether they like to recreationally hunt or if they mow the grass. Um, the ear has a remarkable and it's remarkably resilient to noise exposure. Um, you may have noticed this, let's say, early in the career before you were enlightened about use of hearing protection, where you come away from a particular event on the range, let's say, where your ears are ringing or they feel plugged or stuffy. And it's um it's amazing when you're when you're 24, yeah, uh that hearing recovers over a 24-hour period or so. And but if you if you work and then play with noisy toys, um that can really compound. And then the the lifetime of exposure to noise, uh whether it's previous career or previous job settings, can all lead to a situation, and that's a tragic story, where now someone who loves doing what he was doing uh was no longer able to protect himself or others to be able to locate the not only whether his sound was present, but where it was. So, Michael, um let's talk a little bit about Soundgear. Sure. The chief has mentioned that Blaze and you had had spoken about uh Soundgear. Can for those who haven't uh heard of Soundgear previously, can you talk a little bit about why it is that we develop this technology?
SPEAKER_01Yes, absolutely, Dave. Uh soundgear is a product that we've had for some time, and we have differing uh variations of the Sound Gear product, right? We have active products, we have static products, but you know, the the the two products that you uh you know hear us talk most about is our Sound Gear Phantom product and our Sound Gear Instant Fit product. And both of these technologies are active hearing protection as you have them in your hand, Dave. Uh the black are the custom phantom products, and then the orange are the non-custom instant fit product. And these products both suppress the loud, harmful noises while amplifying your situational awareness, so your surroundings, so you have the ability to have protection, but yet hear what you know your fellow first responders, colleagues are are um saying. So this is something that over the last few years we've really made it a priority at Starkey to grow the Sound Gear brand. As you mentioned earlier, yes, uh first and foremost, we are a hearing aid manufacturer helping people with our you know best in the market technology. But at the same time, how can we, with our current technology and continuously creating new sound gear technology, how can we prevent hearing loss on the front end? And this is something that I've uh you know been especially proud to be a part of over the last couple of years as we grow this brand, not only for first responders, not only for our military, uh, but think about loud industrial. Think about other recreational areas where you're constantly exposed to loud noises. Well, products exist, number one, that work. The one thing that we haven't mentioned, right? The research shows that foamies, 70, 80% of the time, you don't even get them incorrect, right? I mean they're sticking halfway out of the ear.
SPEAKER_02If I can see most of them, no.
SPEAKER_01So using it is one thing, but are you properly using it, right? So here is technology that delivers the protection, delivers the amplification, and you know, certainly the custom product, right? Guess what? There's only one way to put it in because it's custom to your ear, the phantom product. So we're really proud of prioritizing this. Um, you know, we had a great experience with uh, you know, Chief Bedicks in Arizona State. And uh over the last couple of years, we've been growing our Sound Gear market federally with the Department of Defense. Uh, they're in the process of procuring the non-custom Instant Fit products. Our military men and women and folks within the VA have the ability to purchase our Phantom products. We're seeing that growth in that area. And we're prioritizing local and state law enforcement across the country, right? Because they are on the front line. They are constantly around loud noises. So, you know, conversations that we're having not only with individual police departments, but with state legislators, guess what? They want to help protect individuals hearing uh in their state. So, you know, sound gear is something that uh, you know, from the top down we've made a priority, and there's a lot of uh potential uh to continue to grow that brand over the next over the next years.
SPEAKER_02So, Chief, then let's talk about uh at ASU. How did the process go? You had to get approval uh for uh for support to try to come up with protection, and and and was that a difficult process? Did you meet a lot of resistance?
SPEAKER_00No, to the contrary. So Michael and his team came in, and you know, just like any other salesperson, you know, we had a meeting, our command staff sat around the table, they showed us their products, and uh, and we we did a couple uh tests. You know, we had we had a couple officers uh get get the sound gears. And then as I mentioned previously, we bought them for those eight new recruits. Right. And we didn't buy them until we got positive feedback. So the first group, I think there were seven of us who got the uh the sound gear phantoms.
SPEAKER_02Phantoms, the custom ones.
SPEAKER_00We got them, went to the range, couldn't believe they were extraordinary how well they worked. And what's really nice is in Arizona, as you know, it's quite hot. So a lot of our officers wear what's called a uh a bonnie hat or a booty hat or whatever. So I'd have to say hat with the because you want to stay out of the sun. Well, those are not conducive to the ear buffs and uh and and you know, putting the foamies and stuff really just didn't cut it. So we buy the Soundgear Phantoms for uh for the for the uh first seven, and the results were I should say the reviews and evaluations were really good. So we're like, okay, you know, let's let's uh let's take it to the next step. And then we did our firearms training unit and those eight recruits. So that was another 20 units that we purchased. And then I made those officers, I actually sent an evaluation format to them, and I said, you know, how do you like the product? What do you don't like about it? And the reviews were were glowing. I got every single 12 reviews that I got back were were uh all extremely positive. And then the last question was, do you think we should buy this for the rest of the department? And it was 12 guesses. Wow. So, yeah, we had it was the end of the year, we had some money that was uh left in one of our accounts that we had from asset forfeiture, and and those funds are always ear more towards training and products or equipment. And so we decided to buy them for the rest of the department, and and everybody loves them.
SPEAKER_02That's terrific. And did you have did did they have the opportunity? They said yes, we should recommend this for the entire force. Did they give specific reasons? Because I can think of a couple, but I was wondering if any of those reasons came out in their uh suggestions.
SPEAKER_00Well, a lot of the things I already highlighted. Uh the ease of use, the custom, the ability to have them in. You know, when I wore mine, I have a set. I put them in when I got to the range, and I didn't take them off until or taking them out until I got in my car to drive home. Because you can leave them in. You're able to hear the range instructor, you know, telling you how many shots to fire, how many, you know, you could hear when people were firing alongside you. You can hear when people are behind you. And it's so funny, one of my older officers, and it's funny because me and him kind of had a little, we had a debate of who was serving the longest, and he has me by a year or two. When he had his, so he is a now, here's an officer who was wearing hearing aids. So he would have the, you know, you can see the hearing aid behind his ear. And we gave him, he was one of our firearms instructors, and I gave him his sound gears, and he stopped me in the hall one day. He goes, Chief, these things are great. He goes, I can't hear anything with them. And I said, Did you turn them on, Ron? He goes, huh? Yeah, yeah. He was only he was only experiencing, you know, the uh the passive text. Yeah, yeah. When we turned it on, it was like the first time he was able to hear. He was like, Wow, he goes, now I could be at the range and I actually can hear people. Because he had to take his hearing aids off probably when he was at the range, especially if he was putting foamies in or if he was using the earmuffs. So that's just one example of an older officer who was embracing technology. And boy, did it it just, you know, the look on his face was like, this is amazing.
SPEAKER_02I love that. And and the question I have then a follow-up of that is you talk about most of them using them on the range. Do you have any? You talked about that other use case where you're walking in as a first responder into a situation where there are sirens and alarms and other things going off that are pretty loud and difficult to understand, but but they could still hear to communicate with each other. Do any of them use them in an active duty kind of so we encouraged them and we bought them?
SPEAKER_00They all have them, they're all small keys, they could keep them on their pocket somewhere. A lot of them wear outer duty vests that they could put these in. We have a brand new uh 6,000 seat arena on campus where the coyotes used to play, but then we also had concerts. And the officers, because it was so loud inside there, it's a closed environment. So they were wearing them at the concerts. If they're walking into a building with the fire alarm going off, uh home football games. We have 65,000 people in a stadium, and there's you know, pyrotechnics going off and stuff like that. And what's the beauty of it is is you know, if if you're just putting in that passive hearing protection at a concert or something like that, now you can't hear your radio. But with the phantoms, you're able to hear the radio because it picks up that those other noises.
SPEAKER_01You know, that that's the great, the great thing about the phantoms, and and we talk with you know law enforcement folks across the country about this. There really isn't a situation when you can't have them in, right? Because they're accustomed, because you get the protection and you get the situational awareness, right? Whether you're you know driving in your squad car, whether you're out, you know, at an event, we see a lot of utilization of these at large sporting events, right? Where perhaps the university has their own police or their contract with the local sheriff or state highway patrol, who then use these because it does get loud, as we can all attest to in these events. So the great thing because it's custom, because you get the amplification, it's Bluetooth, it's rechargeable, there really isn't a situation while you're on active duty, while you you know, right that you can't utilize this product.
SPEAKER_02Right. And and and going to that, I mean, I I think my dad worked at a paper mill in Wisconsin where he was in continuous noise throughout the day. So he needed the best passive attenuation that he could receive. You've highlighted several cases that that I didn't even think about before, where it's sort of you're going in from quiet into noise, then back out again, and always wanting to be able to hear and locate where sounds are that I think. You know, really make a compelling argument that this should be table stakes for every police force and first responder.
SPEAKER_00Well, and and it's funny because, and that was quite part of my selling point when we as a command staff, because it wasn't just my decision, we all we sat around a table and our command staff uh together collectively decided that we were gonna move forward to make this purchase. You know, we buy equipment for our officers, we buy them bulletproof vests. They're not cheap, they're over a thousand dollars. And hopefully the officer never ever uses that during his career. It's a piece of equipment that we hope they never use. Well, we made this purchase. We knew they were gonna use them. We knew they were gonna use them at the range, they were gonna use them in the arenas, inside the buildings during fire alarms, and we're we're taking that proactive step to prevent and protect their hearing so they're they could, you know, they could work 20 years, they could work their full careers. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And and the other piece, uh, Chief, if you don't mind commenting on, I I think, you know, Arizona State did a great job. I mean, obviously, Arizona's Arizona State, the university in general, is known to kind of be on the forefront of embracing new technology and developing new technology and and as as a university. Um but when you when you had success and you fit your officers, you reached out to the local media, right, and actually got uh you know some earned media from some of the Phoenix uh uh stations from the perspective of look, we're doing what's right for our officers, right? Their health and wellness, because of the comorbidities related to hearing loss, we understand how important this is, and we're taking an initiative, you know, unlike few universities have. So talk a little bit about you know what you did with your local.
SPEAKER_00Well, ASU loves to be, they claim to be number one in innovation. And uh, President Crow over the years, I think it was like seven, eight years in a row, number one in innovation. So we that was one of our talking points. Like, we want to be innovative. Because we knew there was nobody else in the Valley, the Metropolitan Valley of Phoenix, that had this type of hearing protection. And lo and behold, we found out that we're one of the first departments in the nation to actually do something like this. So we contacted the local media stations. They're like, hey, how about a feel-good story? Because too often you turn on the news and it's something negative. Right. Or like, how about a feel-good story? You know, here's something we're doing for our officers. We're being proactive and we're purchasing them equipment to help protect their ears. And they all jumped on it. It was on the five o'clock news. Our own media department did a story on it, and it's on our website. So very positive.
SPEAKER_02That's fantastic. And I mean, I just can't thank you enough for raising awareness. I mean, we I I spend my career, my professional career as an audiologist trying to raise awareness for the importance of hearing as a vital human sense. In your case, it relates directly to safety and to be able to extend an officer's career by protecting the hearing and really raising that awareness early on with those new recruits. But also, it sounds like you even made converts out of some of those more senior officers who now recognize, okay, the benefit of extending their careers at a point in time where they're getting, you know, more days behind them than in front of them.
SPEAKER_00I had a senior firearms instructor came up to me and shook my hand. He goes, Chief, best piece of equipment you ever bought for us.
SPEAKER_02Well, and so although the majority of our audience is professionals, dispensers, hearing instrument specialists, and audiologists, there are also maybe uh consumers out there who listen from time to time, and I think for this episode. Um, so if you are engaged in noisy activities, uh and particularly like intermittent activities like that, where foam ear protection isn't convenient or you don't use it, and if your ears ring or are plugged or you're noticing difficulty with your hearing, seek out the help of a hearing care professional who can talk to you about the different options. Go to Starkey.com or the Sound Gear website, which I'll give to, I'll throw to Michael in a minute, but to help see what options exist for you. But importantly, as the chief said, with these phantoms, which are custom, um it's really critical that you see someone who's comfortable making impressions in your ears and getting a good fit, so that as you said, you'd wear them all the day, the full day or however long you're at the range and forget to take them out until you get into the car. That's great. But that's crucial that a good impression, that that's a good seal, provides that comfort and fit and all day comfort.
SPEAKER_01And and for those of you, you know, who are on or listening to the podcast that are hearing professionals, many of you have local universities in your backyard, colleges, police departments. Reach out to you know, somebody at the local university or at the police department within the university and talk to them about hearing protection. Reach out to, you know, you could reach out to me or others on the Sound Gear team, and we can provide information to help you go in and make the case to your local department about the importance of hearing protection. Because clearly, as as we heard from Chief Beddocks and the use case at Arizona State, this is a product that officers uh want to wear, uh, and it is making a difference. So uh think about ways in which you can spread the message about sound gear in your local community to uh law enforcement first responders and others.
SPEAKER_02Website for Soundgear? Soundgear.com. Okay. And uh for professionals or end users. Absolutely. Well, Chief Beddocks, I can't thank you enough for uh your service.
SPEAKER_00Thank you.
SPEAKER_02And also for being with us here today to spread the word about your efforts, which really are remarkable in the way that you did this at the grassroots level.
SPEAKER_00I don't want people to be like I was. We more or less had our head in the ground and we didn't know this type of technology was out there, and and anything that I can do or you know my team was able to do to spread the awareness and and because it needs to be be known that it's out there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and now you have moved from ASU, correct?
SPEAKER_00Well, I actually retired.
SPEAKER_02Retired. So now you are in South Carolina, you're gonna be chasing down your grandchild. Yes. I love that, and uh, and congratulations on retirement. That uh that is a well-deserved uh honor. And I can tell you, as a grandparent myself, uh it nothing better. So uh look forward to that next stage of your career to be able to now, with the protection that you provided, to hear that grandbaby when they're born. Michael, thank you as always for being here and and for offering this up your uh uh to see people at www.soundgear.com as well. I'll reiterate what I said at the opening. For if you have ideas for future topics, this was Protect Your Hearing Month, and Soundgear is the appropriate topic. But if you have other topics, send us an email at soundbites at Starkey.com. Thank you for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with your colleagues or friends. Like and subscribe so that we can continue to offer great content for you in the future. And until then, I thank both of you for being with us today, and uh, we look forward to seeing and hearing from you again very soon.